Court Strikes Down Gideon Bible Distribution

[Misanthrope]

Justice at work :001_smile:
Enjoy some Bobby Vinton whilst you read
http://www.last.fm/music/Bobby+Vinton/_/Blue+Velvet

Source: http://scienceblogs.com/dispatches/2...ideon_bibl.php
Posted on: April 28, 2008 9:09 AM, by Ed Brayton
In yet another court loss for the Tangipahoa Parish school district in Louisiana, a Federal judge has ruled that the schools there cannot allow the Gideons to distribute Bibles to 5th grade students (see full ruling here). The ruling was in response to a motion for summary judgment. In this case, the Gideons were not allowed to go into the classrooms to distribute the Bibles, but were set up outside the principal's office. The 5th grade teachers were told to inform their classes that they could pick up a Bible there, but also that they did not have to get one. Nevertheless, the judge noted that the peer pressure to take a Bible amounted to de facto coercion:

When time came for "Jane Roe's" class to get their Bibles, the students were instructed by their teacher that if they did not want a Bible, they should remain with the sixth-grade class. Jane alleges that she felt pressured to get a Bible because of potential teasing and name-calling by her peers if she refused. As a result, she accepted a Bible, and she, like everyone else receiving a Bible that day, was told by the person from the Gideons, "God bless."...

Jane Roe states that she accepted the Bible because if she did not, her classmates would have "picked on" her. She feared they would call her "devil worshipper," and that "she don't [sic] believe in God," and that she is a "Goth."

All of this rings quite true to anyone who has spent time in schools. The court then concluded that under the coercion test, the school violated the Establishment clause:

As a result, the Court concludes that the practice undertaken by Loranger Middle School did violate the Establishment Clause. Jane Roe was, in fact, subjected to an unconstitutional element of coercion as she, an impressionable young elementary-age child, experienced pressure to support or participate in religion or its exercise, or otherwise act in a way which establishes religion.

The judge then evaluated the policy under the Lemon test and came to the same conclusion:

The same result follows under the Lemon test. As to the first prong, the Gideons were given access to the elementary school during school hours to distribute Bibles to fifth grade students. The School Board has failed to set forth a secular purpose for this practice, and in that absence, this Court determines that the distribution of Gideon Bibles is "unquestionably religious." See Berger, 982 F.2d 1160. As for prong two, allowing the Gideons to distribute Bibles under the circumstances in this case evidences a preference towards religion, specifically, Christianity. And as for prong three, the teachers who were required to inquire as to which students want the Bible, and then organize and direct them to the principal's office, became excessively entangled with religion.

And likewise under the endorsement test. The judge here, like Judge Jones in the Dover case, smartly evaluated the policy under every conceivable test the higher courts might choose to apply. That's a good way to avoid having one's rulings overturned.

[LegalSmash]

This will get overturned.

Coercion under lemon in this case would not carry weight with SCOTUS IMHO, because the Lemon test looks at the school's role in the coercion. Here, the school simply told them that there were bibles available, and that they could get one if they so chose to.

The Gideons having access to public facilities, such as a school is no more different than the Muslims doing the same at a University to hold events, or the Jews.

The judge's clerk is confusing state based coercion with "people around you shaming you into doing shit" coercion. By passing out the email and telling the teachers that the kids were to be told NOT to go should they not want to, he did the classic cover your ass move, which is enough in most cases.

She was coerced by perceived peer pressure, and honestly, if she was that insecure with herself, then perhaps she should grow a backbone. The judge's characterization of "coercion" will be a point of contention on appeal. One which I think will cause a reversal at least to determine that section.

"not, her classmates would have “picked on” her. She feared
they would call her “devil worshipper,” and that “she don’t [sic]
believe in God,” and that she is a “Goth.”"

this is not state coercion, even under the cases cited by the plaintiff.

There wont be a forcing of the bible upon her, I think this case will get overturned by a higher court... and religious groups tend to be appeal happy.

What ever the result, very interesting read, case, good deal dude!

[Havok]

"The Gideon Bible is the religious equivalent of Channel Five News. It's utter shite." - My History teacher last lesson.

:thumbdown:

[Italian Jew]

But you shouldn't be allowed to let any religion have the opportunity to hand out religious texts or ideas in a public school. You have to have the school's permission to set anything up in the school as they are not "public" in the sense that anybody can go in and do what they want.

Universities are different from elementary schools because the religious programs are sponsored by student groups, not the university (unless it is not publicly funded). The University may provide a room, but they have no say at what goes on in the room unless it is illegal. Outdoor activities are usually allowed with no restraint unless it turns hostile or there is a presence of illegal materials/activities.

Elementary schools have no public forum rooms besides cafeterias or auditoriums/gyms. They can not rent out these rooms but have to ask special permission through the school system. Usually they are not allowed to do anything non school related until off hours when academics are not in session.

There is more free choice at universities than in Elementary schools. In grade school, you feel obligated to do things because an adult or friend pressures you. That is why those people tried to give out books to children because they would feel the need to accept it. It is child psychology and there is no use in saying that they should grow some backbone as this is how it has always been and always will be.

[PotshotPolka]

Arm yourself with flashbombs Havok, tonight we make kindling!

[LitKey]

"The Gideon Bible is the religious equivalent of Channel Five News. It's utter shite." - My History teacher last lesson.

:thumbdown:

So he said that, and then you just took his word for it? I'm quite disappointed, Havok. That was a bad comparison.

[Italian Jew]

They have been replacing Gideon bibles in hotel rooms with sex kits in some places.

Let's start a group and place Torahs and Qur'ans next to the bibles!

We can also throw in Harry Potter as well.

Depending on the version you get, its either Christianity for noobs or Bible Lite with both trying to advertise the religion. Also, some are cheesy enough to where they include phony coupons for salvation and like million dollar bills with Reagan's face on it (or you might get those separately from peeps on the streets trying to sell you the religion)

Personally I think the sex kits are a better fit for hotel rooms...

[Slavic]

give em buckets of condoms, it will do them better

[phatman76]

My first comment is that if this chick is so afraid and embarrassed by her beliefs she should read the damn bible and learn to have some strength....

Second, I agree with legal. The school didn't coerce her. It tried to prevent peer pressure by having the teachers do the "cover your ass move" also. Finally, the supreme court is loaded with enough non-wackos these days that we can trust they wont be retarded.

Many of the people who started this country were religious, I'm sure they wouldn't have a problem with some people actually practicing one instead of living in fear of ACLU terrorizing...

[Italian Jew]

Silly rabbit...strength comes from Bowflex, not the bible... :001_tt2:

(Your results may vary)

Hell, you can get strength from reading the back of a cereal box if you wanted to.

The school did not force her to do anything, but it shouldn't have allowed them in there in the first place especially since they went there to target the children. If they weren't, they would've come AFTER classes. Vendors are not allowed in schools to peddle their merchandise, so why should others be allowed?

Any other religion would not have even been allowed to step in there and do the same thing. A little christian bias leads to some slides in morality and law.

What it really comes down to is a)is handing out a specific religion's text in a government funded building keeping the government secular and b)did it violate the Establishment clause. You could say that this act did violate the Establishment clause because handing the bible is showing preference to a certain religion and the bibles show no secular purpose.